This week I had the chance to sit down with two fascinating guests who are at the forefront of bridging the worlds of digital performance marketing and traditional television advertising. Nick Fairbairn , VP of Growth Marketing at Chime , and Andy Schonfeld , CRO at Tatari , walked me through how they've transformed Chime from a pure digital-first, DTC neobank brand built on social and search into a sophisticated advertiser that runs television campaigns with the same performance mindset they apply to Meta and Google. Their partnership has evolved from small linear TV tests six years ago to a comprehensive full-funnel TV strategy that blends brand building with direct response metrics. Nick and Andy shared incredible insights into the evolution of performance TV , from navigating the COVID-era inventory opportunities to understanding why linear TV still matters even as streaming dominates the conversation. They explained how Chime approaches television with a portfolio strategy , balancing premium reach moments like live sports with more targeted direct response placements, and why creative and media planning have become the "new targeting" in a world where precise one-to-one identification remains expensive and imperfect. We also dove into the challenges of measuring TV in a fragmented landscape, the role of AI-driven creative , and whether shoppable TV will actually move the needle or remain a marginal innovation. Key Highlights Here's a shorter version: 📺 From Walled Gardens to TV: Chime shifted from 80% Facebook/Google spend to treating TV as a performance channel, not just brand awareness. 🚀 COVID's Opportunity: The pandemic opened premium TV inventory at discounts as major advertisers exited, accelerating streaming adoption for performance marketers. 🎯 Performance TV Defined: Measuring full-funnel impact from awareness to account openings using spike attribution, MMM, and Tatari's platform. ⚡ Linear Still Works: Live sports and big moments deliver results at 75% off rate card for brands buying real-time through platforms like Tatari. 💰 The DR Valley of Death: Pure direct response TV hits limits, requiring investment in premium brand moments with longer attribution windows for growth. 🤖 AI and Creative Over Targeting: Paying 2-3x CPMs for precise targeting isn't worth it—creative and smart placement beat perfect identity resolution. 📱 Shoppable TV Reality: Interactive ads and QR codes show promise but remain marginal in business impact; AI-generated creative variations offer more upside. Resources & Next Steps 🔗 Learn more about Chime 📊 Explore Tatari's performance TV platform 🎧 Subscribe to Next in Media on Apple Podcasts YouTube Chapter Timestamps 00:00 Opening - Performance TV and Chime's evolution 00:55 Introducing Nick Fairbairn (VP Growth Marketing at Chime) 01:00 Introducing Andy Schonfeld (CRO at Tatari) 01:10 Chime's historic media mix - born on social and search 02:00 The classic DTC journey - 80% in Facebook and Google 02:20 Bringing a portfolio approach to acquisition 02:40 Meeting Tatari and starting the TV journey (2019) 03:00 Initial barriers - cost, creative, and optimization concerns 03:40 Running TV like Meta from day one 04:10 Linear focus in the early days (2016-2019) 04:40 Small doses of TV with incrementality and attribution 05:00 How COVID accelerated streaming adoption 05:40 Major brands exiting created inventory opportunities 06:00 Fire sale opportunities on premium inventory 06:30 Nick's resistance to streaming at first 07:00 The linear purist becomes a 50/50 believer 07:40 Defining performance in TV advertising 08:20 Full funnel measurement - awareness to enrollments 09:00 Getting efficient on walled gardens to fund brand TV 09:40 The DR valley of death explained 10:10 How performance TV measurement has evolved 11:00 Starting lower funnel, then expanding upward 11:40 The $10-15M threshold where DR hits limits 12:10 Going premium - live sports and big moments 12:40 The commitment required to unlock TV's power 13:10 TV driving IPOs and acquisitions 13:40 Helping startups scale through TV 14:00 The state of CTV today - better or more complex? 14:40 Linear vs streaming buying challenges 15:10 Cost prohibitive targeting on streaming 15:50 Creative differences between linear and streaming 16:20 What's missing - the dashboard fantasy 17:00 Why linear still matters - 50% of viewership 17:40 Yankees playoff game example - 75% discount 18:30 You can't buy big moments programmatically 19:10 Relationships still matter in TV buying 19:50 Programmatic CTV limitations 20:30 Media mix modeling and holistic measurement 21:30 Identity and targeting in TV - does it matter? 22:10 Creative as the new targeting 22:50 Why paying 2-3x CPM for precision isn't worth it 23:30 You can't measure it all - need multiple approaches 24:00 Shoppable TV and interactive ads - bullish or not? 24:40 QR codes and send-to-phone - still marginal 25:10 Pause ads opening new real estate 25:40 Amazon remote ad
