John welcomes Andrew Sullivan—former editor of The New Republic, first-wave blogger, current Substacker, pioneering gay marriage advocate, #BritishGayCatholicConservative public intellectual, and controversy magnet for nearly 40 years—to discuss the Trump 2.0 era and Sullivan’s recent New York Times op-ed, “How the Gay Rights Movement Radicalized and Lost its Way.” Sullivan argues that Trump is less an aspiring dictator than a wannabe monarch; that, even so, his enthusiasm for state terror tactics is ominously authoritarian; and that the gay rights movement has gone astray with its embrace of the trans agenda. Sullivan also explains his adoration of Pet Shop Boys, and why “Being Boring” is their greatest song.
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