Why Are Muslim Fertility Rates So Fragile?

In this episode, we debunk the myth that Muslims will dominate global demographics due to high fertility rates. We delve into the data showing declining fertility rates across Islamic countries and look at the various strategies these nations are employing to reverse this trend. From cultural campaigns and economic incentives to restrictions on family planning, we explore why these measures are failing. Highlighting intriguing case studies from Iran, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE, we discuss the implications and what can be learned from their approaches. Tune in to uncover the complexities of this pressing issue and what it means for the future.

Here is the story I mentioned putting together. If you guys like it I will make more.

I Got Isekai'd as the Eighth Hero But Decided to Become a War Criminal Instead

The Eighth Hero: Audio Book https://drive.google.com/file/d/1x8FvZnsJSambIlYngUS0oYDl2WjT09Je/view?usp=sharing

The Eighth Hero: Text https://docs.google.com/document/d/1AxKVJudMdMZ2oPyS2E0j9rxTQOxDNayvFKjOiwLcLB8/edit?usp=sharing

The Discord: https://discord.com/invite/EGFRjwwS92

Simone Collins: [00:00:00] Hello Malcolm. I'm so excited to be speaking with you today, especially because we're talking about a big misnomer in the demographic collapse world, which is that Muslims are gonna take over the world 'cause they're gonna have perpetually high fertility, which is just not true as Kamir recently pointed out on X.

And what's most interesting is when you go into what various Islamic countries and Muslim majority countries are trying to do to keep their birth rates up. It's basically. A buffet, an overloaded buffet of all of the disparate policies of the different camps that the prenatal movements want. There's the culture stuff, which, you know, we are always like, it's the culture, it's the culture's, the culture.

Well, they did that stuff. And then there's the, all the, you know, it's the, there, it's the payout people. Well, it's all about the giving money and cash payouts and cash pays, what they're doing that, and, and then there's also the, the people who are like, no, it's traditionalism and you know, early marriage.

It's the marriage. It's the marriage. Well, they're doing that too. And guess what? They're also doing the whole thing of scaling back, family planning, like taking away access to birth control and abortions. And that's not working either. And so I think [00:01:00] it's really important to look at, at the Middle East and Islamic countries as a case study and say, alright, so there is this world in which everyone got their way.

All the prenatal leaders with all their disparate little pet projects got their way. Why is it not working?

Malcolm Collins: And I, I'd point out here then people are like, well, don't, some Muslim populations have a high fertility rate. Muslims are not high fertility. They're poor. Okay. It's a mistake that people make.

Muslims are actually have a lower fertility than Protestant groups when you control for income. And their fertility rate is so low that despite the relative poverty of the Middle East. Only Iran. You were saying what? What was it? Iraq only. Iraq

Simone Collins: Only Iraq. Only. Iraq. Israel, because I think Israel's a really great.

Like, here's where we are with developed non non-Islamic Middle Eastern nations. And I think it's a really good base. And of course it's, it's the ul Ultra Orthodox Jews that are really propping this up. You know, they're, they're killing it. They're doing great, but they've [00:02:00] figured it out.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. So in this episode, what we are going to be covering is crashing fertility rates around the Islamic world. Yes. Crashing fertility rates within the Islamic diaspora. Mm-hmm. What the Islamic communities are attempting to do to decrease this. And there are

Simone Collins: some really, there, there are some policies in here that like.

Are so insane in terms of a over the top. You will not believe it Malcolm. I'm like, what? So there's some good stuff in here.

Malcolm Collins: Great. Okay. Let's go

Simone Collins: and then, and then try to figure out what do we learn from this? 'cause they're not working. So, there's a mio. This, this was all inspired by him because he is so freaking amazing.

We love him. He posted on x basically like a clarification to people because, especially in X as a whole, like Muslims. He writes, there's a myth that the Islamic world has figured out fertility, but it has not, they show the same declining fertility rates that other places have, barring Iraq. The Middle East has lower fertility rates in Israel, and hopefully you could put a, this graph that he shared up on the screen.

Showing this just overall declining [00:03:00] fertility graph and infertility rates births per women in the, the Middle East, basically with Iraq at the top, then Israel, then Algeria, Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Oman, Libya, and so on. With the UAE at the bottom. But I love the UAE because you're gonna see they have my very favorite.

Prenatal is policy. I can't wait to get to it. And this graph that we're seeing really tracks global fertility rates in general. And that's an argument that Mio makes in the comments of this thread where people are like, oh, what about this? What about that? And he's just pointing out, no, everywhere this is happening.

And that I think is a really important theme of all this. So he continues in his thread. Exceptions, maybe Yemen and maybe Palestine, both of which have terrible data. So their comparative situation is unclear. But two things on that. Firstly, Jewish fertility is the head of Arab fertility in Israel, and he shows a graph of fertility rates in Israel of basically the average number of births per woman for Jews and others in Israel, and then Arabs in Israel.

And what's really [00:04:00] interesting with this graph, if you're just listening Arabs in 1990 were at. Eight, eight kids per woman and Jews were hovering a little bit below four. They were at at 3.49. And now in 2018, or at least as of 2018, they were basically at exactly the same spot 3.05 for Jews and 3.04.

For Arabs. And so Arabs just are, are freaking plummeting. And there's something, and this is why we're always so interested in Jews and in Jewish culture and like what's going on in Israel, right? Because they are holding strong in the face of modernity. So anyway, REU continues. Secondly, Israeli fertility might be just ahead or slightly behind.

Palestinian fertility, depending on the source. Israel, Israeli growth is definitely head of Palestinian growth due to immigration, Palestinian immigration and Palestinian mortality. So he shows another graph, fertility rates, births per women in Palestine, in Israel, again, Palestine. Arab Islamic [00:05:00] Muslim going down, Israel, holding steady.

So he continues. So no, I don't believe in Islamic excellence in fertility. Even their famously fcan culture is not immune to the global baby. Bust, not in Denmark. And then he shows basically after. Muslim immigrants spend some time in Denmark. Their fertility plummets, they normalize to normal Denmark fertility levels.

He continues, nor in France. And even if we look at second generation immigrants not shown in the graph. He, he had but linked below and we can link to his same sources and then he shares his sources. And, and basically he sho